To receive a presentation from the Chief Constable of Thames Valley Police, Jason Hogg, and the Police and Crime Commissioner, Matthew Barber.
A 30 minute presentation will be followed by an opportunity for Members to ask questions.
Minutes:
Council received a presentation from the Chief Constable of Thames Valley Police (Jason Hogg), supported by Matthew Barber (Police and Crime Commissioner) and Andrew Cranidge (Local Police Area Commander - Bracknell and Wokingham).
Matthew Barber introduced the item by referring to the comments made by the Youth Council representatives. Mr Barber was engaging with young people about ways to involve them in some of the Thames Valley Police (TVP) independent advisory groups.
Mr Barber stated that one specific area of concern was knife crime. TVP were currently participating in a national week of action to address knife crime. Over the past year knife crime in the TVP area had reduced by 4% which was good news. Levels of violent crime in the area were also amongst the lowest in the country. In order to tackle knife crime, the force had developed a tougher approach to those found in possession of knives. Steps had also been taken to pilot the speeding up of intervention from the Youth Offending Team. This would be rolled out across Berkshire over the next 12 months in partnership with local authorities.
Mr Barber referred to the Crime Fighters Plan, launched earlier in 2023. This aimed to improve public contact with the police, for example using the 101 number. Another current issue was retail crime which was being addressed through new systems to enable easier crime reporting by businesses. Finally, work with the Family Drug and Alcohol Courts had reduced demands on the police and local authorities. Judicial powers were being used to reduce reoffending and keep families together.
Jason Hogg delivered the presentation which included the following points:
· Thames Valley Police in Numbers
· TVP Staffing – 4,970 police officers and 3,571 police staff
· Force Review – new Local Command Unit Structure
· Doubling the number of Neighbourhood police officers
· Right Care, Right Person – response to incidents involving mental health, medical or social care
· Force Activity – April to September 2023 – 508k contacts from the public, police attended 81k incidents
· Wokingham Local Policing Area – burglary, drugs, retail theft, bike theft, car meets, anti-social behaviour and E scooters.
Following the presentation, Councillor Stephen Conway thanked Mr Barber and the TVP representatives for attending the meeting and answering Member questions. Councillor Conway welcomed the comments on the importance of prevention and early intervention and the emphasis on partnership working. Finally, Councillor Conway thanked TVP for their work in keeping residents of the Borough safe.
Members then asked the following questions:
Councillor Pauline Jorgensen
Question:
Talking to shopkeepers and the police in Woodley, I have been told that there is a problem with shoplifting. I understand that there will be more local police resources - will we see more in Woodley shopping precinct where they can respond quickly to issues? What is going to happen there and are there any other actions the Council or local communities can take to help you in dealing with this issue?
Answer:
Matthew Barber – one of the things that TVP are doing is to use the Assessment and Investigation Unit to handle a lot of the volume crime. The creation of what was, effectively, a Business Crime Team, with dedicated PCs and civilian staff, will make a real difference in identifying prolific offenders. Mr Barber had had discussions with the industry about this. Arguably, around 65% of offences were down to prolific offenders. Organised crime fell within this area. In terms of practical improvements, stores would receive a shoplifting pack which asked them to provide CCTV and other evidence. TVP were working with businesses to agree how this process could be made easier. Everyone should recognise that this is about partnership, not just about the police doing more. It is about businesses reporting more effectively and taking on board the crime prevention advice being provided. I am aware of an example where an off-duty police officer intervened and detained a shoplifter. When asked to report the incident, the shopkeeper declined as the goods had been recovered. There is more we can do, working with the Council, to build that strong ecostructure.
Jason Hogg – Partnership working is the key. Some of the big national stores report crimes but do not provide details of what was stolen or CCTV footage. Work is ongoing to develop a joint protocol, with the stores setting out how they can work together with the police. Analysts are working to link offenders to the offences. By the end of the month it is expected that shoplifting CCTV will be linked to retrospective facial recognition software via the Police National Database. This will lead to more offenders being identified more quickly. It is important that the stores play their part in this process. TVP can’t step in to cover gaps in the private sector but we are committed to standing up to the challenges relating to the number of arrests and positive outcomes, including people being brought to justice.
Councillor Clive Jones
Question:
Shoplifting is a major concern for residents of the Borough. This week I witnessed a shoplifter walking out of Morrisons with armfuls of unpaid-for food. The person is a regular visitor to the store and is well known to staff, but nothing was done about it. A number of shop managers are now telling me that it is not just individuals, it is becoming more and more organised crime. Do you have the necessary resources to tackle shoplifting, not just by individuals but by organised crime?
Answer:
Unfortunately, I don’t have enough resources to do everything that I would like to do. As mentioned earlier, a key aspect is developing stronger partnerships with local and national retailers around crime prevention and reporting. In terms of organised crime, there is a new initiative called Operation Pegasus which will allow the police to identify organised crime groups operating across police force areas. This will involve running CCTV images of suspected shoplifters through the national crime database. The results will tell us where organised gangs are operating and allow us to target resources accordingly.
Councillor Stephen Newton
Question:
A few months back at a
meeting of the Thames Valley Police and Crime Panel, I asked you
about the number of officers per 100,000 population as the
Government report published on 1 December 2022 showed Thames Valley
as 32nd out of the 42 police forces in England and Wales with just
180 police officers per 100,000 of population, whereas the top 21
forces all had over 200 officers per 100,000 of
population.
You will recall that I
was concerned about how this might impact response times and the
ability to follow up on reported crimes and you mentioned that
Thames Valley Police had been recruiting since this report was
published.
My questions
are:
· What is the current number of Thames Valley Police officers per 100,000 of population?
· What is your target number of officers per 100,000 of population and when do you anticipate achieving this on a sustainable basis?
· What improvement have you seen in response times and/or prosecution rates with the additional headcount and are you satisfied with these outcomes?
Answer
The funding formula is the biggest issue which the Home Office could address. From conversations with Ministers it appeared that it was not the Home Office but the Treasury. It is not about getting more money, it is about how the pie is sliced up. If we received the average settlement the force could reach 250 officers per 100k population. Would that be the target? The Chief Constable has stated that he would like to get to 500, but we have to be realistic. A useful metric is the number of charges, which has risen by 3.7% from last year to this. Charge rates are important, but it is also about the outcomes for the public. As an example, charges for burglaries were lower than the force would like but burglaries were down by 37% across the Thames Valley. The preventative work, mentioned earlier, was really important and we are starting to see some benefits from those increased police numbers.
Councillor Morag Malvern
Question:
A local business has had two thefts of maintenance equipment, and despite clear details of the vehicle used in the first theft being available, the Police did not attend. Residents in the development off Matthewsgreen Road, elsewhere in the same ward, are reporting that night after night the same small group of men are visiting the estate and systematically trying the doors of cars parked in driveways. I understand that many residents have provided the Police with security camera footage of these men's activities, along with information on the hours they operate. This has been going on for more than two months and has greatly increased in the last three weeks. As you'll appreciate residents are very worried. What is the best way of making Thames Valley Police fully aware of what's happening? What re-assurance can you offer our residents and businesses on the action to be taken by the Police?
Answer:
Andrew Cranidge – We are aware of this issue. Each morning we review a series of crime types, one of which is theft and theft from vehicles. The Priority Crime Team reviews the data and carries out visits as necessary. In the past week there has been a spike in vehicle crime. Sometimes this relates to organised crime groups and sometimes it is local offenders. If you can pass on the exact details, I will look into it. The fact that residents are reporting these incidents is really important as it helps to focus our resources, for example through targeted patrols in local areas.
Councillor Rachel Bishop Firth
Question:
I’m sure that all of us, as Councillors, are deeply disturbed by the signs that conflict in the Middle East is spilling into community relations here in the UK. I know that many of us felt personally affected by the scenes that we saw over the weekend which led to over 100 arrests. I have had residents raise with me that they are now concerned for the personal safety of themselves, their family, and their friends.
What steps are the police taking to ensure that all residents are kept safe – whatever their beliefs, ethnic origins, or birthplace - and that wherever possible positive action is taken to build understanding and respect between communities, and what support can we, as Councillors, provide?
Answer
Matthew Barber – What is happening internationally is concerning to us all. Many people did not think that it would spill out onto our streets the way it has done in the past months. TVP has made great efforts to reach out to synagogues and mosques, proactively making contact and making it easier to raise concerns. There have been a few isolated incidents across the Thames Valley, but nothing on a major scale, as reported elsewhere. Sometimes, people see incidents in London and assume that they are happening everywhere, but this is not the case. TVP have a good track record of managing protests of all kinds. A number of recent events have been managed well, particularly over the past weekend. The best way forwards is for level heads to prevail, to reassure people and to make people aware of the increase police presence without scaring people into thinking that they need a police presence every time they go to the synagogue or mosque. This is not what we are seeing on the ground. Any issues relating to offences linked to protests and attacks on religious groups are being addressed by the CID and local response officers.
Jason Hogg – We have a command structure in place with daily reporting of hate crime. I hosted a recent visit from members of the Jewish community with the Head of the Community Safety Trust. I have received many letters of thanks from people who attended protests from different backgrounds, religions and beliefs. TVP has dealt with more protests than any force outside the Met. Staff are very experienced. The role of the police is to facilitate peaceful protest but, at the same time, to be robust in enforcing the law. There have been no serious issues at any of the protests held since 7 October.
Councillor Andrew Mickleburgh
Question:
The Wokingham Today newspaper dated 8th December included a lengthy article concerning the release, the previous day, of His Majesty’s Inspectorate of Constabulary and Fire and Rescue Services’ Child Protection Services Report.
You are reported in that newspaper as saying that while this report recognises some of the good work being done, there were [quote] “clearly some serious concerns. I’d expect the Chief Constable to be making those changes as quickly as possible.” Could you please summarise the concerns that were identified and what processes are in place within Thames Valley Police to support, monitor progress and evaluate the effectiveness of measures that you are expecting to be implemented?
Answer:
Matthew Barber – If you read the full report, it does talk about some good work and some good cultures, which are the most important thing in relation to child protection. It is a challenging area. Local authorities have the same experience with Ofsted reports which present challenges. Most of the recommendations are around governance processes aimed at ensuring that the work being done is properly captured, analysed and is subject to proper oversight. One of the areas relates to data sharing of child abuse images and the sharing of other safeguarding information. Some of that has already been addressed because the inspectors came in in May 2023. Also over the summer, some of the backlogs have been addressed. The force has implemented some robotic automation through the Multi Agency Safeguarding Hub (MASH). Hopefully, this will minimise backlogs in the future. Some of the actions are done, which is encouraging, but I do not want to minimise some of the issues that need to be addressed. The Chief Constable and I have regular liaison meetings as well as the more public performance and accountability meetings, where we look at those recommendations. There is also a Gold group, chaired by the Deputy Chief Constable, which works through the recommendations line by line. Some of the recommendations have time limits, so we will seek to meet those. I have to respond to the inspectors in addition to the Chief Constable. I would also say that, just because HMIC has made a recommendation, it is not necessarily a requirement. Sometimes it is right to look at recommendations and say “we hear what you say, but think not”, because we are doing things in a different way. I am not sure that this applies here, but I am careful not to say that we accept everything, otherwise we are not critically analysing the recommendations and understanding what is being asked.
Councillor Michael Firmager
Question:
I did put in a question about police numbers, but it has been answered through the presentation. To add to that, where do you want to be with regard to police numbers moving forwards. What are your requirements?
Answer:
Matthew Barber – I would love to be at 500 officers per 100k population. I am sure that the Chief Constable would be delighted with that but it is aspirational. I have said that I want to achieve the Home Office number, which we have done, but moving forwards I would like to grow our numbers in line with the growth in population. Going back to the point made earlier, it is important not to slip back. We know that our population will continue to grow, so that is the minimum I want to get to. Ultimately, the big win will be changing the funding formula to enable us to have significant growth. At the moment, the only other headroom I have is by taxing local taxpayers that bit more. With the budget pressures we have our inflation costs are likely to be about £22m this year. That is a significant cost and there is only so much we can do in that incremental rise through the Council Tax. What I really want is a review of the funding formula which would allow us to recruit more heavily.
Councillor Rebecca Margetts
Question:
Residents from the Gorse Ride Community in Finchampstead do not always get responses when reporting anti-social behaviour incidents to the Police. Can you advise the best way for residents to report incidents and what can be done if they do not get a response?
Answer:
Andrew Cranidge – The best way to report it is by dialing 101 or using the on-line web form. The Council also has an Anti-Social Behaviour team which works closely with TVP. That team provides another reporting route – their process is via email which is monitored. If you can’t make contact, it is probably best to contact me if it is a local issue, explaining that the system is not working properly. The increasing number of Neighbourhood officers will also provide another point of contact. In relation to E scooters, we will be starting work on this issue as a force. Quite often, young people should not be using E scooters and there is an issue around parents not understanding the law. We will use the 3 E’s approach – engage, explain then, ultimately, enforce. This should become more visible through December and January. We will also work with Road Policing colleagues to tackle any traffic offences. If you can share the details, I will discuss with the Neighbourhood Team and report back to you.
Councillor Jackie Rance
I wanted to say that it is comforting to hear that, in relation to knife crime, the offender is brought in the next day and is dealt with. I was a Berkshire magistrate for 15 years. In those days, it would have to wait for bail and then would come back to court. In terms of sentencing, the guidelines were knife equals prison, so it is very comforting to get them off the street.
Councillor Sam Akhtar
Question:
From the presentation, it is good to see that the number of burglaries and break-ins to dwellings are down. One of the things I notice in my ward, Charvil, and the neighbouring wards of Sonning and Wargrave, is that more and more thefts from homes do not involve break-ins – this is to do with an increase in thefts of cars. It would be good to know what the police are doing to promote the use of Faraday Pouches and to tackle the role of organised crime in these keyless car thefts.
Answer:
Andrew Cranidge – You hit the nail on the head. This is the work of organised crime groups who find opportunities after watching residents. As with burglary, this is about how we share intelligence across TVP and neighbouring forces. These organised groups move around the country. We have done some work with the motor manufacturers on the sale of cars with Faraday pouches. We also use Thames Valley Alert to raise awareness in local communities. We use local intelligence to decide where to put our resources. This includes marked vehicles and plain clothes officers. Roaming officers are able to help with those patrols. We have had some success in getting organised criminals locked up for some time.
Councillor David Cornish
Question:
I would like to read an email to the Chief Constable, sent to me just last week by a resident of Nine Mile Ride in Finchampstead.
"We and four of our near neighbours had our garden sheds broken into and a range of goods and tools stolen, with a value of about £1k per household.
My next-door neighbour and I both reported the crime to Thames Valley Police. The others said that there would be absolutely no point in doing so. Unfortunately, they were proved to be correct. About six hours after reporting the crime using the TVP online system, we received an email which in essence said: “you haven't given us a photo or CCTV, or a name of the criminals, so the case is closed”. They made no attempt to discuss the crime with us or make a visit.
I can understand the operational challenges you have in responding to every crime in person. But, given your comments earlier about the figures for burglary showing a downward trend and that, in this instance, three victims out of five did not report the crime at all, does this provide some explanation as to why that trend is there?
What can we actually do, you and us as Members, to reassure our residents that household burglary is not, in effect, being decriminalised?
Answer:
Jason Hogg – I believe that you are referring to sheds rather than house burglaries. We do have a different response to the theft of tools as opposed to house burglaries. One of the challenges we have faced for a couple of years is the new entry routes into policing where officers need to have a degree when they join us or get a degree when they join. This means that we have had to release officers in order to spend time studying. The impact of that is that between 30% and 90% of the time of our Neighbourhood teams has been spent backfilling our Response teams. So, we haven’t had many Neighbourhood officers on our streets over the past two years. On a positive note, we made announcements yesterday about changing our entry routes and removing protected learning time, thereby reducing the need to backfill. By January 2024 we will have a 90% reduction in the staff needed to cover. From January, our Neighbourhood officers will be out in our communities, doubling the numbers. That, in itself, will make a difference. It is important for people to report crimes to us. We won’t investigate every single crime, but we can look for the links. I live in a rural area where there have been a number of attacks on garages and sheds. Residents have formed a WhatsApp group and report suspicious people or vehicles to the PCSO who checks them on their behalf. We feel that fear of crime has decreased as we have a strong connection with local communities. Taking photos or keeping details of the contents of sheds and garages is useful. We recover stolen property all the time but it is often difficult to return it to the owners without the relevant details. The Neighbourhood team will be happy to visit residents. We can also provide crime prevention advice and free shed alarms.
Councillor Caroline Smith
Question:
Many residents have well-founded concerns about the very dangerous way in which electric scooters and some of the more powerful electric bikes are sometimes being ridden. Can you please clarify what advice is currently being given to Police Officers in situations where the use of these items is being done in a demonstrably dangerous and sometimes illegal manner? Specifically, where circumstances would allow for the confiscation of the scooter or bikes, are Officers being encouraged to do so – or to adopt a different approach?
Answer:
Jason Hogg – I get more letters about E scooters than anything else. It is a challenge. There is a gap in the law. Local Police Area Commanders met recently to consider this issue. In December we will be running a publicity campaign aimed at parents, encouraging them not to buy E scooters for Xmas. I am sure that some people riding E scooters do not know that they are illegal. They can only be ridden on the road or pavement as part of a Council accredited scheme. You would need a driving license, insurance and a helmet. You cannot get insurance for an E scooter, so they are illegal. We will be moving to enforcement quickly and will be prosecuting the parents. We will be seizing a lot of these scooters. This is a subject of public concern. There have been two high profile cases, in Wales and Salford, where police officers have been investigated after pursuing youths on scooters. I am not prepared to put my officers in a situation where they could lose their livelihoods. There is a gap in the legislation here which the Government is looking at. We will be proactive in prosecuting offenders and taking E scooters off the streets.
At the conclusion of the Q&A session, the Deputy Mayor thanked the Police and Crime Commissioner and police representatives for attending the meeting.
RESOLVED That:
1) Matthew Barber, Jason Hogg and Andrew Cranidge be thanked for attending the meeting to give the presentation and answer Member questions;
2) the presentation slides be circulated to all Members.